Just a Georgia peach aren't ya! You replied to my post, so if you don't want to chat, don't respond, it's not rocket science. I see you understand now there is more to trans care than walking in and getting hormone therapy which is what you stated in your first response and misinformation stops once people have been properly educated. Moving on.✌️
Like I said educate yourself about transgender individuals but use credible information. People don't want to educate themselves but will repeat disinformation as if it were fact. No child is forced to have any operations and actually young children don't get any treatment much less surgery until often later teen years and that is usually only hormone treatment. That is after having a mandatory thorough mental health eval., attend trans groups, see a specialized doctor etc. Who are you to tell someone who or what they can call themselves? You don't even have a simple understanding about being trans and surely haven't read about trans kids feelings some as very young children telling parents they aren't a boy as they were born but a girl and they are consistent. All I hear is talk about the horrors of trans treatment and they are wrong to feel how they feel. But those same people never talk about how ugly and hateful kids and adults are that torment those kids for being different or how it affects the child. How horrible when parents abuse their child because they are trans and put them out of the house. I feel blessed to have kids and I will love them unconditionally, whether they are gay, trans, are disabled, etc. It shouldn't be that difficult especially for the pro choice right, all lives matter. Right? That is my issue with maga fascists that are pro life, that is until the child is born and has to be taken care of, is LGBTQ, not the right color, etc. That is my problem with all the BS we've listened to about the kids, but the right isn't very concerned about harming the kids verbally, mentally, or with violence. That is the problem we should be looking. Sick people villifying kids all for an election talking point or to demonize the left. Ugly any way you look at it.
Seriously. The only treatment any kid gets is puberty blockers. If they "made a mistake" just go off them and things revert. This is not a tough concept to understand. My kid came out as trans during Covid. At 33 years old, I don't think that was a spur of the moment gender fashion trend. Good lord when did people decide they were cis anyway? They just are.
I don't know what state you're in but in CA and when I did research about 17 years ago hormones were given however just as I said even with hormones which they didn't just give out freely a mental health and medical eval had to be done regardless if you were 15 or 40 for good reason. A teenager (female to male) at 16 who had undergone all required steps in process could have a mastectomy if their parents gave signed consent. A few years ago I read i believe the AMA was just completing a blueprint for a medical protocol for trans care completed by a team of specialists, with the focus on youth. Re. Diagnosis and plan of care. Guess it was done different in different places. Just stopping hormones doesn't mean everything is normal after stopping them. Dosage and length of time taking them can be the difference in no effect or permanent effects.
I'm in Georgia, but my kid came out in their 30s, so I'm not aware of the fine point of how teens are treated.
Even as an adult no one here is doing anything surgically until there's been a raft of medical and psych evals, and the minimum time for that for an adult is about two years. So it's hardly like someone wakes up one day and goes oh I think I'll switch genders. Yes I know that stopping HRT doesn't instantly reverse things, but two thumb typing and a core dump on biochemistry is not my idea of a relaxing morning with coffee chatting with people lol
One thing that was clear in election results Republicans worked to turn people against each other. They keep dividing the small groups, based on identity politics. We have to work together, to fight for each other, and expand protections for all humans, like the shirt says:
Equal Rights for others does not mean fewer rights for you. It's not pie.
Very good. Damn straight rolling over never appeases abusers. This isn't about the the actual question of trans rights, that's something we can figure out. It's about sacrificing values of human rights. Any position that allows that is highly suspect. Betraying the rights of some betrays all of us.
The right won on rejecting the status quo, by hijacking an understanding of our common cause. That cause has to be strengthened & clarified, NOT homogenized & turned into something that further marginalizes some. What needs to be put back in a closet is the dysfunctonal, aggressive behavior that is running rampant. Giving permission to dominate any demographic enables abuse of the rights of all of us. We know this, we know our allies are not to be sacrificed & we can't support leadership that says we should.
Why are they anonymously saying these things? Are the left bullies? Has Putin weaponised this faultline of liberal overeach?
Is it because identitarianism is non compromising autocracy from the individual outwards.... rather than from the state inwards? People with reservations and concerns regarding transgenderism and particularly gender fluidity see individual primacy conflict with societal mitigations that make wonen sacrosanct and protect minors who cannot give informed consent.
I am deeply suspicious of absolutes on either side... what is needed is process that society can have confidence in. Strangely the left that is supposed to believe in society more hands that batton to the right in this case... leftwing libertarianism anyone?!
Ps. Drag artists dressing up like hyper sexualised divas is not a compliment to women either... it's supposed to be fun ....in a panto... I spose.
These people talk about the right, the left, the far left, etc., as though they’re not relative. Much of what used to be considered “centrist “ is now “radical left-wing” because the right has pushed the scale so far to the right.
The willingness of some Dems to abandon the fight for equal rights for ALL disgusts me.
Also–off point, I know—the term “Dark Ages” is no longer used by historians because it’s inaccurate and Eurocentric. There was plenty of innovation and progress going on during the Middle Ages, the period between the fall of Rome and the emergence of the Italian Renaissance; it just wasn’t all happening in the West.
Here’s an idea from someone who is absolutely ignorant to your fight, invites a poor me, a snarky gee how’d you ever survive? Perhaps, as I’ve said, the Republican Party is dead, the Democrat Party should give itself a funeral, wooden box and shovel the hole. I’m here to say that I don’t want to talk, understand or share if I can’t ask how to do ME better by helping YOU by understanding what I can never but certainly support, have a voice and have real conversations because I get some shitty sarcasm. Does inclusion go both ways? Fuck that’ll get hate….see what I may be talking about? That’s how it feels. The discourse is between US. Fuck the party narrative. Explain how I can do better and “get” it so i don’t feel like I’m intruding but also being included as there ain’t much grey area in this. Isn’t that the fkn point? Stupid only stays stupid when one can’t ask the hard questions and address each other and not one up. I say this with respect but also reservation. I’d like to think time spent to invest in one person, leading to another, to somehow drowning out those who scream into an abyss the fkn iceberg was at fault. Don’t ever let the captain jump into a rescue boat but….we just did. As stated, how many know a T? You either learn what you don’t understand by doing the only thing one can…start the narrative or remain ignorant. Or keep snarking and close the doors. Not much middle in that either.
Transgender people have rights, the same rights as anyone else. What transgender activists are advocating for is special rights. Trans people do not have the right to be people of the opposite sex, because they are not people of the opposite sex. Minors should not be subjected to medical treatments designed to simulate the opposite sex. And government should not force people of one sex to play sports or share bathrooms with people of the opposite sex. If private organizations want to allow this, that is their own business, with which government should also not interfere.
Just like the maga fascist government stays out of women's lives, right? Or remember when Blacks couldn't use a white bathroom. Seems like the gov. is in alot they shouldn't be and it is only going to get worse now that we have a fascist government.The fascist right made trans people an issue. They are like 1% of the population and never put themselves in the spotlight, the hateful right did. I don't agree with trans women playing in women's sports but as usual the right made this an issue to demonize trans people. Learn what being trans is about, educate yourselves and shut your mouths with the ridiculous accusations and name calling.
I am not calling anyone names or vilifying anyone. The only people I object to are those advocating for special rights or forcing minors to undergo irreversible treatments to simulate the opposite sex. I don't care what people wear or how they refer to themselves. However, a male referring to himself as a female does not have the right to be considered to actually be a female for all intents and purposes.
There you go again, referring to minors being forced. What possible motivation could there be for that? By what logic would anyone be doing this to "YOUR" children? Minors are being harmed alright & it's not by gender non-conformity. It's by people trying to make their world views dominate. There is a lot to be learned in the questioning of gender roles. White male supremacy has not served us well. Trans people are not a threat to children, they are seen as a threat to patriarchy. Trying to make it out to be something else isn't working. The only real consideration is if there is an unfair advantage in sports competition. As rational adults we can address that question. But not when you are making it into something other than what it is, making it a holy war for your own identity, undermining others right to their own identity.
Your argument depends on your definition of what a sex is, the belief that what we are born to is our fate. That goes against principles of self-determination.
I've observed some unreasonable expectations, expectations of "special" rights, but I don't believe that's the issue overall. I don't believe minors as being "subjected" to medical treatment. I think we need to look at the issues clearly, not based on some of these assumptions.
Sex refers to an unalterable biological conditions. No matter how much they might wish it, males cannot give birth. And permanently altering the bodies of minors to simulate the opposite sex is morally repugnant to many people, including myself, and the medical justifications for doing so are highly questionable. If adults want to do that to themselves, that is another matter, though I think doctors prescribing doing so is still reprehensible.
It is not unalterable, we have many advances in medicine.
Giving birth is not the definition of a woman.
I reacted with concern myself, thinking young people may be making adult decisions before maturity. But if you start looking at the facts, the choices are in alignment with sexual development. It's not like we are non-sexual until 18. Denying sexuality causes problems. We need more understanding of it, not less.
I believe the parents that say they know their own children better than you do, the parents that choose to support their child in gender identity choices. They have just as much parental rights as you do. They are supporting their children. You don't have the right to impose your beliefs on others. The choices are not yours to make. It is not your body or your choice. You aren't going to "protect" others whether they like it or not.
The exclusive ability to bear a child is part of the definition of the human female sex, as well as that of the female sex of many other species. Sex is an unalterable biological fact. And it is my understanding that some of the medical procedures intended to simulate the opposite sex are unalterable.
I'm disgusted by the party I have voted for since I started voting at 18. What a bunch of feckless jerks. Maybe Dems lost because many of them are seen as feckless, the sky is falling, whiners. The clusterfuck after the election from pelosi, carville, etc. was disgraceful, just as the Dems worrying more about appealing to hateful, ignorant people than to care about a small percent of people who just want to be left alone, to live their life and be happy. Unfortunately, hateful fuckers find them to be an easy target and these Dems are showing their asses targeting them too. Right now I don't feel as if I have a party in alignment with my values and that stands up and speaks for those who cannot speak for themselves. These Dems have proven that an election win is more important than the safety and well-being of other human beings. I have always and will continue to stand up for all people who have been treated poorly and harassed for being who they are. The fucking fascist bastards are running the country and some Dems are showing their maga side now without shame. It disgusts me and the Dems should be ashamed of themselves. I'm a straight, white, retired medical professional who feels like an other right now.
Just a Georgia peach aren't ya! You replied to my post, so if you don't want to chat, don't respond, it's not rocket science. I see you understand now there is more to trans care than walking in and getting hormone therapy which is what you stated in your first response and misinformation stops once people have been properly educated. Moving on.✌️
Like I said educate yourself about transgender individuals but use credible information. People don't want to educate themselves but will repeat disinformation as if it were fact. No child is forced to have any operations and actually young children don't get any treatment much less surgery until often later teen years and that is usually only hormone treatment. That is after having a mandatory thorough mental health eval., attend trans groups, see a specialized doctor etc. Who are you to tell someone who or what they can call themselves? You don't even have a simple understanding about being trans and surely haven't read about trans kids feelings some as very young children telling parents they aren't a boy as they were born but a girl and they are consistent. All I hear is talk about the horrors of trans treatment and they are wrong to feel how they feel. But those same people never talk about how ugly and hateful kids and adults are that torment those kids for being different or how it affects the child. How horrible when parents abuse their child because they are trans and put them out of the house. I feel blessed to have kids and I will love them unconditionally, whether they are gay, trans, are disabled, etc. It shouldn't be that difficult especially for the pro choice right, all lives matter. Right? That is my issue with maga fascists that are pro life, that is until the child is born and has to be taken care of, is LGBTQ, not the right color, etc. That is my problem with all the BS we've listened to about the kids, but the right isn't very concerned about harming the kids verbally, mentally, or with violence. That is the problem we should be looking. Sick people villifying kids all for an election talking point or to demonize the left. Ugly any way you look at it.
Seriously. The only treatment any kid gets is puberty blockers. If they "made a mistake" just go off them and things revert. This is not a tough concept to understand. My kid came out as trans during Covid. At 33 years old, I don't think that was a spur of the moment gender fashion trend. Good lord when did people decide they were cis anyway? They just are.
I don't know what state you're in but in CA and when I did research about 17 years ago hormones were given however just as I said even with hormones which they didn't just give out freely a mental health and medical eval had to be done regardless if you were 15 or 40 for good reason. A teenager (female to male) at 16 who had undergone all required steps in process could have a mastectomy if their parents gave signed consent. A few years ago I read i believe the AMA was just completing a blueprint for a medical protocol for trans care completed by a team of specialists, with the focus on youth. Re. Diagnosis and plan of care. Guess it was done different in different places. Just stopping hormones doesn't mean everything is normal after stopping them. Dosage and length of time taking them can be the difference in no effect or permanent effects.
I'm in Georgia, but my kid came out in their 30s, so I'm not aware of the fine point of how teens are treated.
Even as an adult no one here is doing anything surgically until there's been a raft of medical and psych evals, and the minimum time for that for an adult is about two years. So it's hardly like someone wakes up one day and goes oh I think I'll switch genders. Yes I know that stopping HRT doesn't instantly reverse things, but two thumb typing and a core dump on biochemistry is not my idea of a relaxing morning with coffee chatting with people lol
One thing that was clear in election results Republicans worked to turn people against each other. They keep dividing the small groups, based on identity politics. We have to work together, to fight for each other, and expand protections for all humans, like the shirt says:
Equal Rights for others does not mean fewer rights for you. It's not pie.
And that is why MAGA will ultimately fail. I'm just worried about the rest of the people they'll take down on their way out of power.
Very good. Damn straight rolling over never appeases abusers. This isn't about the the actual question of trans rights, that's something we can figure out. It's about sacrificing values of human rights. Any position that allows that is highly suspect. Betraying the rights of some betrays all of us.
The right won on rejecting the status quo, by hijacking an understanding of our common cause. That cause has to be strengthened & clarified, NOT homogenized & turned into something that further marginalizes some. What needs to be put back in a closet is the dysfunctonal, aggressive behavior that is running rampant. Giving permission to dominate any demographic enables abuse of the rights of all of us. We know this, we know our allies are not to be sacrificed & we can't support leadership that says we should.
2020 should've been the end of the Republican party.
Since we missed that opportunity, I'll settle for 2024 ending the Democratic party.
Also:
"that self-styled objective media treat treat it like a Newtonian law.
What a treat. Two for the use of one.
Why are they anonymously saying these things? Are the left bullies? Has Putin weaponised this faultline of liberal overeach?
Is it because identitarianism is non compromising autocracy from the individual outwards.... rather than from the state inwards? People with reservations and concerns regarding transgenderism and particularly gender fluidity see individual primacy conflict with societal mitigations that make wonen sacrosanct and protect minors who cannot give informed consent.
I am deeply suspicious of absolutes on either side... what is needed is process that society can have confidence in. Strangely the left that is supposed to believe in society more hands that batton to the right in this case... leftwing libertarianism anyone?!
Ps. Drag artists dressing up like hyper sexualised divas is not a compliment to women either... it's supposed to be fun ....in a panto... I spose.
If someone gets scared by the ads, the way to solve it is by educating them about what they don't understand.
Not by abandoning what scares them.
Abandoning transgender people only confirms to the scared people that they are right to be scared.
It used to be biracial couples that were going to destroy us all. Remember those days. Guess that was a nothingburger just like the trans issue.
Really don't think this was even an issue in this campaign, and was only brought up because of the stupid Republican lies.
These people talk about the right, the left, the far left, etc., as though they’re not relative. Much of what used to be considered “centrist “ is now “radical left-wing” because the right has pushed the scale so far to the right.
The willingness of some Dems to abandon the fight for equal rights for ALL disgusts me.
Also–off point, I know—the term “Dark Ages” is no longer used by historians because it’s inaccurate and Eurocentric. There was plenty of innovation and progress going on during the Middle Ages, the period between the fall of Rome and the emergence of the Italian Renaissance; it just wasn’t all happening in the West.
Here’s an idea from someone who is absolutely ignorant to your fight, invites a poor me, a snarky gee how’d you ever survive? Perhaps, as I’ve said, the Republican Party is dead, the Democrat Party should give itself a funeral, wooden box and shovel the hole. I’m here to say that I don’t want to talk, understand or share if I can’t ask how to do ME better by helping YOU by understanding what I can never but certainly support, have a voice and have real conversations because I get some shitty sarcasm. Does inclusion go both ways? Fuck that’ll get hate….see what I may be talking about? That’s how it feels. The discourse is between US. Fuck the party narrative. Explain how I can do better and “get” it so i don’t feel like I’m intruding but also being included as there ain’t much grey area in this. Isn’t that the fkn point? Stupid only stays stupid when one can’t ask the hard questions and address each other and not one up. I say this with respect but also reservation. I’d like to think time spent to invest in one person, leading to another, to somehow drowning out those who scream into an abyss the fkn iceberg was at fault. Don’t ever let the captain jump into a rescue boat but….we just did. As stated, how many know a T? You either learn what you don’t understand by doing the only thing one can…start the narrative or remain ignorant. Or keep snarking and close the doors. Not much middle in that either.
•• An Open Letter to Trump Voters ••
The True Cost of Your Ignorance and Idolatry
https://open.substack.com/pub/patricemersault/p/an-open-letter-to-trump-voters?r=4d7sow&utm_medium=ios
Transgender people have rights, the same rights as anyone else. What transgender activists are advocating for is special rights. Trans people do not have the right to be people of the opposite sex, because they are not people of the opposite sex. Minors should not be subjected to medical treatments designed to simulate the opposite sex. And government should not force people of one sex to play sports or share bathrooms with people of the opposite sex. If private organizations want to allow this, that is their own business, with which government should also not interfere.
Just like the maga fascist government stays out of women's lives, right? Or remember when Blacks couldn't use a white bathroom. Seems like the gov. is in alot they shouldn't be and it is only going to get worse now that we have a fascist government.The fascist right made trans people an issue. They are like 1% of the population and never put themselves in the spotlight, the hateful right did. I don't agree with trans women playing in women's sports but as usual the right made this an issue to demonize trans people. Learn what being trans is about, educate yourselves and shut your mouths with the ridiculous accusations and name calling.
I am not calling anyone names or vilifying anyone. The only people I object to are those advocating for special rights or forcing minors to undergo irreversible treatments to simulate the opposite sex. I don't care what people wear or how they refer to themselves. However, a male referring to himself as a female does not have the right to be considered to actually be a female for all intents and purposes.
There you go again, referring to minors being forced. What possible motivation could there be for that? By what logic would anyone be doing this to "YOUR" children? Minors are being harmed alright & it's not by gender non-conformity. It's by people trying to make their world views dominate. There is a lot to be learned in the questioning of gender roles. White male supremacy has not served us well. Trans people are not a threat to children, they are seen as a threat to patriarchy. Trying to make it out to be something else isn't working. The only real consideration is if there is an unfair advantage in sports competition. As rational adults we can address that question. But not when you are making it into something other than what it is, making it a holy war for your own identity, undermining others right to their own identity.
Your argument depends on your definition of what a sex is, the belief that what we are born to is our fate. That goes against principles of self-determination.
I've observed some unreasonable expectations, expectations of "special" rights, but I don't believe that's the issue overall. I don't believe minors as being "subjected" to medical treatment. I think we need to look at the issues clearly, not based on some of these assumptions.
Sex refers to an unalterable biological conditions. No matter how much they might wish it, males cannot give birth. And permanently altering the bodies of minors to simulate the opposite sex is morally repugnant to many people, including myself, and the medical justifications for doing so are highly questionable. If adults want to do that to themselves, that is another matter, though I think doctors prescribing doing so is still reprehensible.
It is not unalterable, we have many advances in medicine.
Giving birth is not the definition of a woman.
I reacted with concern myself, thinking young people may be making adult decisions before maturity. But if you start looking at the facts, the choices are in alignment with sexual development. It's not like we are non-sexual until 18. Denying sexuality causes problems. We need more understanding of it, not less.
I believe the parents that say they know their own children better than you do, the parents that choose to support their child in gender identity choices. They have just as much parental rights as you do. They are supporting their children. You don't have the right to impose your beliefs on others. The choices are not yours to make. It is not your body or your choice. You aren't going to "protect" others whether they like it or not.
The exclusive ability to bear a child is part of the definition of the human female sex, as well as that of the female sex of many other species. Sex is an unalterable biological fact. And it is my understanding that some of the medical procedures intended to simulate the opposite sex are unalterable.
A limited definition. It's not your call, it's not your life.
That is science. And, yes, it is my call. Your individual rights end where they start to impinge upon the rights of others.
I'm disgusted by the party I have voted for since I started voting at 18. What a bunch of feckless jerks. Maybe Dems lost because many of them are seen as feckless, the sky is falling, whiners. The clusterfuck after the election from pelosi, carville, etc. was disgraceful, just as the Dems worrying more about appealing to hateful, ignorant people than to care about a small percent of people who just want to be left alone, to live their life and be happy. Unfortunately, hateful fuckers find them to be an easy target and these Dems are showing their asses targeting them too. Right now I don't feel as if I have a party in alignment with my values and that stands up and speaks for those who cannot speak for themselves. These Dems have proven that an election win is more important than the safety and well-being of other human beings. I have always and will continue to stand up for all people who have been treated poorly and harassed for being who they are. The fucking fascist bastards are running the country and some Dems are showing their maga side now without shame. It disgusts me and the Dems should be ashamed of themselves. I'm a straight, white, retired medical professional who feels like an other right now.
Blame narrative from Right is already emerging
“There will be hardship, but it’s because they stole from you to fund their pet projects”
Such BS
https://www.westernjournal.com/biden-harris-raided-medicare-fund-green-new-deal-premiums-now-set-spike/
Our eldest is nonbinary. You jettison them and don't event even talk to us anymore. We don't compromise on the right of our kid to exist.
If course he exists.
But society does too.
Where we exist... WE.
Of course.
My son is gay. I agree with you completely.
Outstandingly insightful. This is the flip flopping that truly annoys the disciples.